What should be consider a new character or an update?

[Beto]

Thanks for the support!!!! I usually go to different sites and want to be cool with people. All I want is to make characters and share for the enjoyments not to edit my stuff but things like this are making me rethink if it's better to go private or just call it quits all together. It's really frustrating.

I do not think you need and loganir, leave their private things, is very annoying WHAT happened, but there will always be someone to stop people like that, some people are taking seriously this motto, that everything on the internet is free, things may not end well without rules

[O Ilusionista]

Hum, let me speak here. Watch out for the big wall of text.

-

if you dont mind me asking, what happened exactly? by the time i got there to MMV, Volzilla deleted all the posts you were talking about.

If I got it right, they made some edits over Verz sprites, am I right? Well, this is a grey area...

ah i see. and they call us at MFG jerks huh? I swear if it's people like this that will make verz lose motivation and stuff, then i don't wanna be part of MMV. well, atleast there are people there that are still polite and respectful.

About MFG: I know some people will jump at my neck and I give a crap about it, but there IS a lot of jerks on that place, its a very well known fact. Sure, there are many good names there, but there is many jerks too. And some are approved and endorsed by the moderation/administration team. Some are very aggressive without a particular reason, too sarcastic (sarcams is cool, but when you use it too often, you have some mental issue), like monkeys shitting on their hands and throwing on people's faces when visiting the zoo and they are like "hahahaha *clap* *clap* you are so funny".

Sure, its way better than it was on the past.

About MMV: the problem of that forum is the same problem that IMT has on the past (well, I can see it here from time to time yet) - They need to sugar coat everything. You can't be serious when you give feedback because they got hurt and sensitive. Sure, I am not talking about beeing harsh like "OMFG THIS IS crap" because this isn't even an argument, its just children play...

I am talking about when you give a list of feedback and they doesn't likes it. I remember a day when I give a feedback with a list of things I like and I don't like (its the way I like to give feedback, its easier to the authors to fix this way) and the author got sensitive and said that I was "humiliating him by showing all those points".

Is that really open source? Says who?  Capcom?  Marvel? They're the owners of it.  Did we just decide for ourselves that it was ok to do this? The original sprites had to have been made by someone. One of the "object designers" from Children of the Atom.  An actual person with a name and a family who had to develop the skills to create them in the first place.  We never credit them, but we always build of THEIR work and then call it ours, and then get mad when SOMEONE ELSE does the same thing.  A bit of a double standard, I feel.

You have a point here, but let me explain. The sprites are copyrighted to Capcom, and not Marvel. Marvel owns the characters, but the graphics were made by Capcom. The object designer should be credited, but he doesn't owns anything. He was paid to do that job. I am art Direction and I don't own the works I did, I have intellectual propriety of them, what is a different thing.

[manluis]

Ah yes i know there are jerks in MFG, trust me I know, but I just hate how other forums say that EVERYONE is a jerk there and it gives the forum as  WHOLE a bad rep. If we are talking about individual people, then yeah I would say there are a lot of jerks there who can cross the line at times. But again, I hate it when people target a forum as a whole. It just feels deppressing because I know there are good people in every forum. There will be bad people, there will be good, its just natural like that. But if people deliberately prevent people from going to another forum just because they see that forum as whole a bad way, then thats what I don't like. I hate it when people badmouth MFG,MMV,MFG and every other forum as a WHOLE.

And yes you are right about sugarcoating it in MMV. I get that people can be mean, but sometimes people are just trying to be honest with you and sometimes it just sounds mean, but it's the truth. We say these things and point out flaws, not to be mean, but to make you how much better you can always do to the fullest extent. We say the truth because we trust that you can do a lot better than what you release at the time, because there is ALWAYS room for improvement. No one creation is ever perfect, and it's only up to you to listen to feedback and improve it. If we thought you don't have any talent, we wouldn't have given any feedback. There are no shortcuts in creating, yet people always try to take it but just releasing a rushed character and expecting it only to be praised. It's deppressing.

[verz36]

 well for those that are wondering what went on let me show you a bit first.. after i digest this ill get back and write a full story about how things got to this and maybe most can understand here.. but let me clear something. im a guy that i think we should support the websites. thats what i do.. i try to post at the different ones. but after this incident im not going to promote my work there anymore and if things like this keep happening, then i can see this getting worst..


but look at this for now...
http://elecbyte.com/forum/index.php?topic=4799.0

[ParanormalParanoia]

well for those that are wondering what went on let me show you a bit first.. after i digest this ill get back and write a full story about how things got to this and maybe most can understand here.. but let me clear something. im a guy that i think we should support the websites. thats what i do.. i try to post at the different ones. but after this incident im not going to promote my work there anymore and if things like this keep happening, then i can see this getting worst..


but look at this for now...
http://elecbyte.com/forum/index.php?topic=4799.0

seriously....

[O Ilusionista]

@manluis: I think exactly the way you think.

@verz: I saw it. AxKeeper is using your Cyclops to make a Green Ranger. Can I give you a tip? Ironically, Elecbyte's forum is the WORST mugen community ever. I remember when they come back there was a rush to "reserve seats", from people wanting to say what should and what should not be done. I was eager to contribute until I say those things, so I decided to keep it to me.

[manluis]

@verz it keeps on saying the page isnt available, probably meaning it was deleted or something. anyway, whats this about axkeeper making a green ranger out of your sprites? did he atleast get permission?

[O Ilusionista]

Green Ranger


What do you think?

Also I am using Cyclops by Loganir and Verz as the base if anyone is wondering?!

And

for those of you who have no idea who this is;



I've decided to do this wip, I have everything ready to go and am currently working on the walk. I'll have it posted today!


More progress. Moving onto gethits and falling down stuff. After that I'll start attacks!

[manluis]

sprite itself looks fine, animation? not so much.

did he get permission? one thing that irks me about ax is how he always uses the excuse "MUGEN is free! Everything in MUGEN should be shared!" while its true MUGEN itself is open source, the sprites and custom, original stuff that are made for it isn't unless stated so. it doesn't mean you can use sprites without permission. it's just wrong as a person. you can do it if you want, but people will look down on you if you do.

[verz36]

sprite itself looks fine, animation? not so much.

did he get permission? one thing that irks me about ax is how he always uses the excuse "MUGEN is free! Everything in MUGEN should be shared!" while its true MUGEN itself is open source, the sprites and custom, original stuff that are made for it isn't unless stated so. it doesn't mean you can use sprites without permission. it's just wrong as a person. you can do it if you want, but people will look down on you if you do.

 No he did not get permission and he knows my work it's not open source. I don't have anything against this guy so I don't see what he would want to piss me off with that. It's all about getting along with your fellow mugen creators. Actions like this is what's killing mugen. We need to stop this things and try to encourage new guys to create and be original. That's what I learned when I started this hobby and I tend to keep it that way till I retired which looks like to be soon with what I see now.

[manluis]

i can see how you are pissed about it. I would be too. but verz, remember, we can talk to ax about calmly, with respect. we don't have the right to get mad right away, unless he acts up again, so let's keep this clean and nice. i'l contact ax about the sprite situation soon. and verz, please don't let this ruin your career. it's only one problem and it can be fixed right away if we work with cooperation okay? we all would hate it if you left. you always have people supporting you, like me!

[verz36]

i can see how you are pissed about it. I would be too. but verz, remember, we can talk to ax about calmly, with respect. we don't have the right to get mad right away, unless he acts up again, so let's keep this clean and nice. i'l contact ax about the sprite situation soon. and verz, please don't let this ruin your career. it's only one problem and it can be fixed right away if we work with cooperation okay? we all would hate it if you left. you always have people supporting you, like me!

 I appreciate your support, thanks. I never had any problems with this guy at all so I don't get why he is doing this. I respect others works why can't it be the same towards mines. He knows my work it's not open source. Not cool at all and I hope this stops because then others will take whatever he edits and do the same since his dig say that all he does it's open sourcle.

[manluis]

remember verz, theres always a way to end this peacefully and without much hassle. but in order to get through to the peace, there will be arguments and opinions about it. its natural. there will be stuff like this happening more times in the future and we have to accept there WILL be problems like this everywhere. however its only up to US to look past all that and try to keep pushing forward and settle this.

like i always say "if there is no chaos, there will be no peace, as chaos is neccessary to creat peace."

[HyperVoiceActing]

That's a problem a lot of people in the community have: they think curtosy is stupid.

[manluis]

That's a problem a lot of people in the community have: they think curtosy is stupid.

people just have different views on curtosy.

[manluis]

verz, pm me, let's talk okay?

[verz36]

I just sent u a pm

[manluis]

recieved. i replied.

[Arkady]

I don't think you realise how Ax works, there is no speaking to him about "not using others works" he firmly believes that EVERYTHING is open source, some people can't and won't change their minds
I'm pretty reasonable when it comes to folks using any content ive made to further another wip, as long as its a good effort in completely revamping it into a new character, but that's me, I'm not saying i believe everything should be open source, i firmly believe that certain works, should stay untouched, not only for respects sake, but especially in the case where a creator had given a unique amount of effort to creating a character, and wishes that to remain as closed source, trouble is who polices those who don't follow these "rules"
admins and moderators can only ask that the creators respect the rules, of each respective site, yet time and time again they are blasted for letting a wip reveal such as this go in the public eye, we aren't the mugen police, but most of us respect the open/closed source ideal, if i see things like this i try to make efforts to notify the parties involved and rectify it, but I'm not looking at every thread here or on other sites to be able to help in every situation
i feel that verz should not be swayed by this event, it would be tragic to communities, if he or others who ask that their work is not open source pack up and leave because of a few people that don't respect the content that has been made for the general mugen public

[verz36]

I understand what you Are saying but at the same time. Administrators should do more about this things and this is not the first time this happens but for some reason it keeps happening at multiverse. I got nothing against that site and I see great potential from some of the guys but I see also that not much is done. You don't see that happening here or at crusader cast. Why because who does this will get a warning and if he keeps doing this he gets ban. The less exposure we give to this kind of things, the less people will be doing this but if we encourage it by this so called rules, then we will see many more situations like this. It start at the top. looks like I'm not posting at that place anymore. I don't feel respect there anymore.

[manluis]

the best way to deal with ax? dont. dont bother with him at all. if he wont change, you cant force him. the best way is to just not give any attention to him, think about him or see his sprites. we cant do much to change ax and we have no right to. just move on with it verz, other creators he's took from have also just ignore the issue and pressed on. this is the best way.

[Arkady]

This stuff happens at every site, it just seems to portray moreso at mmv, coz of more new creators seem to venture there, ive spoken to many creators,over similar situations, then new guys keep on appearing once again
its a cycle, and without mmv, it would be here or at other sites moreso
i see no difference, where it happens, we told ax not to do it, it got modded, he just went elsewhere to that electbyte forum, you cannot judge a forum based on a few bad posters, who don't want to change to anyone elses thinking, or simply throw blame at a site for public posting

[verz36]

 Ark, it's not about putting blame on a site. It's that this keep happening because of the so called rules. You don't see that happening here or at other sites because they will ban those that keep trying this and we don't see this been done at mm. Lets see what this will end up like.

[manluis]

This stuff happens at every site, it just seems to portray moreso at mmv, coz of more new creators seem to venture there, ive spoken to many creators,over similar situations, then new guys keep on appearing once again
its a cycle, and without mmv, it would be here or at other sites moreso
i see no difference, where it happens, we told ax not to do it, it got modded, he just went elsewhere to that electbyte forum, you cannot judge a forum based on a few bad posters, who don't want to change to anyone elses thinking, or simply throw blame at a site for public posting

this. i just hate how it discourages fantastic creators and makes them lose motivation like verz.

[verz36]

Also ark, he has multiverse in his sig. If I'm an administrator there I would take actions and won't be affiliated with anybody that can bring troubles to my website unless I support this things.