Why is esnips hated by the mugen Community

[Alexziq]

People in Mugen live for drama is the true reason.

The real rule of Mugen is:

"If there is something to BlTCH about, rest assured somebody will"

Bottom line is Esnips is way more convenient, anyone who believes that searching Google or Yahoo is just as easy to find characters is dreaming. If its main characters, then yeah, but for a lot of stuff I can find in 30 seconds what would take me hours of searching otherwise.

The old guard are just going to have to eventually accept that the fans of Mugen just dont believe in a LOT or the so called rules of the Community.

[Vault-tec Rep Høröúßøí]

  that was like a speech... I almost cryed from laughter thanks to the thought of that being "The real rule of Mugen"

[Tenspeed]

this is the same community that had a flamewar over a guy using a personal edit of a stage in a WIP video from his character. I agree we all need to lighten up on some things, mainly showing videos, hosting creations and edits with credit.

it's one thing to say "I edited acey's green goblin to play like a Capcom vs SNK character, tell me what you think" and another thing entirely to say "check out this capcom vs SNK green goblin I made" a lot of times this gets lumped into the same category.

as far as that whole "we're stealing from capcom to begin with" mentality goes, capcom has expressed that they don't care about mugen because it's fan work. they are teams of faceless people making sprites for a game that they will make money off of, because it's their job. as long as they can make their money at the end of the day, they don't care. creators that use those sprites are doing it for free. they are making every one of those 900+ sprites by themselves usually simply for the activity. the least you could give them is a little credit, or the courtesy to say "hey I'm gonna recode/recolor/resprite/ect your character if it's all the same to you." if you don't at least give credit.

[I_Burner]

People in Mugen live for drama is the true reason.

The real rule of Mugen is:

"If there is something to BlTCH about, rest assured somebody will"

Bottom line is Esnips is way more convenient, anyone who believes that searching Google or Yahoo is just as easy to find characters is dreaming. If its main characters, then yeah, but for a lot of stuff I can find in 30 seconds what would take me hours of searching otherwise.

The old guard are just going to have to eventually accept that the fans of Mugen just dont believe in a LOT or the so called rules of the Community.

I gotta agree with you 100% on this. I know when I first got into MUGEN a few years back, like most noobs I hoarded as many characters as I could get my hands on (OK, to be honest I still do, but for totally different reasons... but that's another topic). I got really frustrated trying to use some of the so-called databases at the time that hadn't been updated in years. Google often didn't get me much besides Youtube videos. Once I found esnips, I was like "finally! I don't have to spend hours just to find a decent version of Sentinel". Like it or not, esnips has actually turned into the net's biggest MUGEN archive, and really does provide a valuable service. People b!tch about the leaked stuff and out-dated characters, which I can't really argue against, but there are also countless creations stored there that would have been lost long ago (or be otherwise inaccessible to newcomers) if someone hadn't warehoused them. 90% of the time, if I can't find something any other way I can find it on esnips.

Some of the "rules" laid down by members of the "old guard" never seemed to me to be anything more than a way for a handful of elitists to try and turn this community into their own special little club, where no one else can play unless they say so (I'm not naming names, but we all know who these people are). Some things are common sense, like not passing off someone else's work as your own or leaking unreleased WIPs, but others just seemed to do nothing but try to deter people from getting deeper into the community (like the "unrequestable" lists - I mean seriously, all that did was create a shopping list for people to go search on esnips ).

Yeah, people just need to lighten up. As long as these "warehousers" aren't trying to take credit for the creation (which few ever do) and aren't knowingly posting leaked/stolen/private stuff, then who gives a f***?

[O Ilusionista]

The old guard are just going to have to eventually accept that the fans of Mugen just dont believe in a LOT or the so called rules of the Community.

Please, do not put all the Old Guard on the same sack. I'm one of those from Old Guard (since, on the next year, there will be 10 years in Mugen) but I do not agree with many things.

Warehouses, for me, aren't bad, specially like Esnips. Warehouse are bad just in cases that the guy host a lot of works as they were made by him. This is really bad. But this affects more the newcomers than the old guard, because a lot of people already know our works and know that what we do.

Some rules are idiot, for sure. Let takes the example of "I do not want my char hosted in any place, because I've quited mugen and don't want it anywhere on the internet". That is a Dream

But some rules, even the newcomers doesn't like them, are for good. Like "do not use work from someone wihout the authorization". Its just RESPECT.

The main problem of the newcomers is that many of theu wants to do a Anarq (or whatever).

Some of the "rules" laid down by members of the "old guard" never seemed to me to be anything more than a way for a handful of elitists to try and turn this community into their own special little club, where no one else can play unless they say so (I'm not naming names, but we all know who these people are).

hehee...yeah, I know they. And I do agree with you.

[ilikedamugen]

im not gonna lie    i have n esnips page and i do put mugen chars on there i have every samuria showdown char i have on there but i did it for ppl who, call it lazyness or whatever the hell u wanna call it, are just having trouble finding chars to make it easy but i have it in my header that i in no part created any of these characters and full credit is given to the creator  as for if ppl removing  the read me files........thats just sad  

[I_Burner]

Please, do not put all the Old Guard on the same sack. I'm one of those from Old Guard (since, on the next year, there will be 10 years in Mugen) but I do not agree with many things.

Don't worry. Just because you've been part of the community for a long time doesn't mean anyone thinks you're a part of that. I'm sure Alexziq was referring to just those people who have been trying to control the community. That's certainly how I took it.

Some rules are idiot, for sure. Let takes the example of "I do not want my char hosted in any place, because I've quited mugen and don't want it anywhere on the internet". That is a Dream

Or even better, a certain creator a couple of years ago who took a character offline, and said "Don't host, don't request it, don't share it, and don't make any videos with it". I was really expecting him to come back and ask everyone who had the character to delete it off of their hard drive. Plenty of copies of that one on esnips now....

But some rules, even the newcomers doesn't like them, are for good. Like "do not use work from someone wihout the authorization". Its just RESPECT.

The main problem of the newcomers is that many of theu wants to do a Anarq (or whatever).

Unfortunately, that's always going to be a problem because there will always be people with that attitude. But what the "MUGEN Police" never seemed to figure out is that these people really just want attention. When you make a huge deal out of some of these things, it just gives them incentive to keep doing it, because they're getting the attention they want.

But that's why Infinity has been the only forum I've been active on, because most people here have a pretty healthy view of what MUGEN is really about  .

[dragonesku]

Seriously, what's wrong with esnips, why do most M.U.G.E.N. forums hate it?

First of all this isn't new, I remeber back in the day (1 year ago), even the hardcore warehouses had strict rules on "warehousing", and people still hosted mugen stuff at esnips. Can you all believe that? I know, it's freaking laughable!

This is the only community which from time to time implodes on itself. Look at any other mod community and what they do, and you all see what I'm talking about.

As a contributor on this and other forums, I do not understand why all the brouhaha about sharing stuff (aside from not giving credit) on the web.

[O Ilusionista]

"MUGEN Police"

that is copyrighted to me, hehee

[laspacho]

Not thrilled with it, however as long as my readme is there it will be tolerated, I mean what can you really do about it anyway.   

[Alexziq]

Don't worry. Just because you've been part of the community for a long time doesn't mean anyone thinks you're a part of that. I'm sure Alexziq was referring to just those people who have been trying to control the community. That's certainly how I took it.

Or even better, a certain creator a couple of years ago who took a character offline, and said "Don't host, don't request it, don't share it, and don't make any videos with it". I was really expecting him to come back and ask everyone who had the character to delete it off of their hard drive. Plenty of copies of that one on esnips now....

Unfortunately, that's always going to be a problem because there will always be people with that attitude. But what the "MUGEN Police" never seemed to figure out is that these people really just want attention. When you make a huge deal out of some of these things, it just gives them incentive to keep doing it, because they're getting the attention they want.

But that's why Infinity has been the only forum I've been active on, because most people here have a pretty healthy view of what MUGEN is really about  .

QFT

I just feel as though Ive been an instrumental personality toward things being a tad more light hearted. When I see someone who could possibly be a 12 year old kid getting flamed by a dozen lunatics for 12 pages because he didnt know the so called "respect" guidelines, theres no way anyone is going to justify that to me. I myself dont have time to waste uploading crap, and I try to make sure I clear everything I do or say like a good lemming. I just hate to see some innocent kids getting trashed because of people taking this way too serious, and thats not acceptable to me.

I will say I think Infinity has worked hard not to let things like that happen anymore. Thats why I post here, and no where else in the Community if anyone has noticed.

Theres a good group of people here.

[Doctor Crow]

Unfortunately, that's always going to be a problem because there will always be people with that attitude. But what the "MUGEN Police" never seemed to figure out is that these people really just want attention. When you make a huge deal out of some of these things, it just gives them incentive to keep doing it, because they're getting the attention they want.

You had me going until about here.  Not everyone who comes into the MUGEN community and starts speaking out against all of the bulls*** long-standing unspoken rules is doing it for attention.  Some people, myself included, (or at least this used to be the case with me, i've come to accept a lot of things over time) do it because they want to see change, because they actually are anarchists.  Quite frankly I think that a lot of the rules and guidelines of the MUGEN community are just plain stupid, no two ways about it.  But for me, it was never about getting people to say "Oh there goes Crow again shooting his mouth off so all the n00bs'll listen to him."  For me, it was always about making people understand that I have a message that they should seriously take under consideration, and I don't think that that part of your post was a fair statement, because to me it sounded like you were trying to make all of the people who go against the rules out to be attention whores, which is wrong on several levels.

In closing, I highly support esnips, it's the kind of thing i've wanted to see in the MUGEN community for a long time.

[DARKTALBAIN]

You had me going until about here.  Not everyone who comes into the MUGEN community and starts speaking out against all of the bulls*** long-standing unspoken rules is doing it for attention.  Some people, myself included, (or at least this used to be the case with me, i've come to accept a lot of things over time) do it because they want to see change, because they actually are anarchists.  Quite frankly I think that a lot of the rules and guidelines of the MUGEN community are just plain stupid, no two ways about it.  But for me, it was never about getting people to say "Oh there goes Crow again shooting his mouth off so all the n00bs'll listen to him."  For me, it was always about making people understand that I have a message that they should seriously take under consideration, and I don't think that that part of your post was a fair statement, because to me it sounded like you were trying to make all of the people who go against the rules out to be attention whores, which is wrong on several levels.

In closing, I highly support esnips, it's the kind of thing i've wanted to see in the MUGEN community for a long time.

I'm a press whore . Anything I can do to get in the headlines .... 

Seriously though , I feel the same way . I do not agree with some of the old school rules . I see nothing wrong with someone getting one of my characters from another site . My ego is not that big , that I have to personally hand it to them . Like I said , I create to bring out my artistic talent & to let as many people that wants one of my characters to enjoy it . of people do not know where Team Spoiler's stuff is hosted , even though Mew has a website . So let them get it at esnips or similar website .

I don't mind the esnips guys because they are sharing & asking for nothing in return . It's the traders on youtube that p*ss me off .

[greatmuta2]

I'm a press whore . Anything I can do to get in the headlines .... 

Seriously though , I feel the same way . I do not agree with some of the old school rules . I see nothing wrong with someone getting one of my characters from another site . My ego is not that big , that I have to personally hand it to them . Like I said , I create to bring out my artistic talent & to let as many people that wants one of my characters to enjoy it . of people do not know where Team Spoiler's stuff is hosted , even though Mew has a website . So let them get it at esnips or similar website .

I don't mind the esnips guys because they are sharing & asking for nothing in return . It's the traders on youtube that p*ss me off .

can you explain these traders i really dont know if its even possible to trade a character i could just keep the file man those n00bs are stupid

[DARKTALBAIN]

can you explain these traders i really dont know if its even possible to trade a character i could just keep the file man those n00bs are stupid

I haven't been in that trade game in forever . I got sick of people promising new characters that were just palette swaps & other bullsh*t . Also I did have that happen a couple of times . I'd send out something & they wouldn't send anything back . The traders are the real scum of mugen . Those are the idiots who put some red in a palette , call it a " zombie " character & act like they created it . On top of it they make noobs trade a good character for that crap .

At least warehouses & esnips just shares the stuff with everyone

[greatmuta2]

I haven't been in that trade game in forever . I got sick of people promising new characters that were just palette swaps & other bullsh*t . Also I did have that happen a couple of times . I'd send out something & they wouldn't send anything back . The traders are the real scum of mugen . Those are the idiots who put some red in a palette , call it a " zombie " character & act like they created it . On top of it they make noobs trade a good character for that crap .

At least warehouses & esnips just shares the stuff with everyone

if i got a char from a trader id rename the file def display name of a kfm and give it to them

[DARKTALBAIN]

if i got a char from a trader id rename the file def display name of a kfm and give it to them

What's your youtube name ? 

[greatmuta2]

What's your youtube name ? 

uhhh uhhhh uhhhhh darktalbain? yeah sorry its darktalbain

[Random Regular]

Trading mugen characters is just ridiculous
This is SPARTAAA I mean...This is mugen, not some Pokémon game

What's your youtube name ? 

http://www.youtube.com/user/greatmuta2  

 

[greatmuta2]

Trading mugen characters is just ridiculous
This is SPARTAAA I mean...This is mugen, not some Pokémon game

i never said id do that bulls*** i just made fun of some guy cause i think its retarded crap also dt i was kidding just saying incase you are mad

[DARKTALBAIN]

i never said id do that bulls*** i just made fun of some guy cause i think its retarded crap also dt i was kidding just saying incase you are mad

I'm not mad . I was a trader when I was a noob , just trying to get some stuff for this engine before I knew about the forums & other places . I haven't traded for anything in over a year .

[Thunder Wolf]

i never used to hate esnips until my account was deleted, not by me, and i cant create a new one because of the typing of those words to verify account, i copy it down exactly everytime and it doesnt work.

[I_Burner]

You had me going until about here.  Not everyone who comes into the MUGEN community and starts speaking out against all of the bulls*** long-standing unspoken rules is doing it for attention.  Some people, myself included, (or at least this used to be the case with me, i've come to accept a lot of things over time) do it because they want to see change, because they actually are anarchists.  Quite frankly I think that a lot of the rules and guidelines of the MUGEN community are just plain stupid, no two ways about it.  But for me, it was never about getting people to say "Oh there goes Crow again shooting his mouth off so all the n00bs'll listen to him."  For me, it was always about making people understand that I have a message that they should seriously take under consideration, and I don't think that that part of your post was a fair statement, because to me it sounded like you were trying to make all of the people who go against the rules out to be attention whores, which is wrong on several levels.

In closing, I highly support esnips, it's the kind of thing i've wanted to see in the MUGEN community for a long time.

To be fair, Crow, I think you read my post out of context.... I wasn't at all talking about people who speak out against the "rules". I was meaning that to refer to the people, usually noobs, who show up on a forum and openly disrespect others, or go out of their way to break some of the more sensible rules just to piss people off. You know, the douchebags that will get ahold of a leaked WIP, post it on esnips, and go back to the author's thread and post "I warehoused your char, and there's nothing you can do about it. Ha ha!". There are plenty of people who really *ARE* attention whores, and don't know any other way to get it other than to get people's panties all twisted up. I certainly wasn't trying to lump people who simply try to voice their opinions or are actively trying to change the status quo based upon their own beliefs in with that crowd! Sorry if I didn't get that across effectively the first time. Hope we're all good, dude! 

[Doctor Crow]

To be fair, Crow, I think you read my post out of context.... I wasn't at all talking about people who speak out against the "rules". I was meaning that to refer to the people, usually noobs, who show up on a forum and openly disrespect others, or go out of their way to break some of the more sensible rules just to piss people off. You know, the douchebags that will get ahold of a leaked WIP, post it on esnips, and go back to the author's thread and post "I warehoused your char, and there's nothing you can do about it. Ha ha!". There are plenty of people who really *ARE* attention whores, and don't know any other way to get it other than to get people's panties all twisted up. I certainly wasn't trying to lump people who simply try to voice their opinions or are actively trying to change the status quo based upon their own beliefs in with that crowd! Sorry if I didn't get that across effectively the first time. Hope we're all good, dude! 

It's cool, thank you for clearing that up. 

[C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個]

this is the same community that had a flamewar over a guy using a personal edit of a stage in a WIP video from his character. I agree we all need to lighten up on some things, mainly showing videos, hosting creations and edits with credit.

it's one thing to say "I edited acey's green goblin to play like a Capcom vs SNK character, tell me what you think" and another thing entirely to say "check out this capcom vs SNK green goblin I made" a lot of times this gets lumped into the same category.

as far as that whole "we're stealing from capcom to begin with" mentality goes, capcom has expressed that they don't care about mugen because it's fan work. they are teams of faceless people making sprites for a game that they will make money off of, because it's their job. as long as they can make their money at the end of the day, they don't care. creators that use those sprites are doing it for free. they are making every one of those 900+ sprites by themselves usually simply for the activity. the least you could give them is a little credit, or the courtesy to say "hey I'm gonna recode/recolor/resprite/ect your character if it's all the same to you." if you don't at least give credit.

That is only Capcom what about all the other VG Designers that made these sprites?